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Mats Samuelsson

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  1. 1,163 votes

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    Thanks to everyone for the votes and discussion about having undo independently in each workbook. Even though this request has been here for a long time, we are listening and we realize that it can be frustrating if you press Undo while you’re in one workbook and it undoes something in another workbook. We’ve been considering the technical challenges to make Undo work “per workbook”, and want to share some details about it with you.

    The undo process relies on the state of all open workbooks being exactly the same after an “undo” as they were before the undone action was taken. One example of how undo “per workbook” is problematic is with linked workbooks. Let’s say you have WorkbookA, with a formula that refers to WorkbookB, such as =SUMIFS. This formula will give the sum of values in WorkbookB in range A1:A10 that have “Yes” in the…

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    I had no problem with Undo stacks prior to Office 2016 and Office365.
    I had a fully developed administrative application in Office 2010 and it worked excellently.
    I have been forced to rewrite code in most of it since MS changed to SDI and introduced the ribbon but still it's not working properly. The Undo stack problems came at the same time, probably as they separated the interface. A once "Excellent" program has become a terrible inconvenience we regrettably have to maintain!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    SaintNick and VvM,
    Regrettably I've come to the conclusion that MS created UserVoice to have a site where Excel users can blow off steam. Since Office2010 they have successively downgraded the product targetting the tablet environment. They don't give a **** about users demanding some power and Excellence, they've down to simple icon-making! Look at this topic: 'Restore MDI file handling (open all files in one window); Kill SDI (each spreadsheet opens in a seperate window)'

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  2. 1,321 votes

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    Thanks for the support and the detailed discussion around this suggestion. We understand that there are some advantages and disadvantages with both MDI (multi-document interface) and SDI (single-document interface), and we currently do not have plans to revert to MDI. We do want to improve the experience with SDI so you can get your work done efficiently, and this post has helped toward that goal.

    Some of the specific issues mentioned are addressed as follows:
    – Stability: This has been a focus over the past several years, and the monthly releases in 2020 have been among the most reliable ever in terms of avoiding crashes.
    - Screen space – while it won’t get all the space back, you can minimize the ribbon to save some space. It only shows when needed.
    - Navigation between workbooks: you can use CTRL+F6, SHIFT+CTRL+F6, CTRL+TAB or SHIFT+CTRL+TAB to switch to the next workbook. …

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Simply Microsoft, you don't address any of the huge disadvantages with the current Excel. The ability to have MDI is one major request, the awful ribbons taking up too much real estate is another, the lousy undo behavior, the poor drag an drop copying, etc, etc are other major requests........and you don't give a single answer or explanation to any of them! You have seen the long list, do you really believe you may stop the criticism by splitting up the issues on separate uservoice tasks, it's standard divide and diversion tactics and it's disrespectful!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Well Ax, I'm also one of those extremely frustrated and I fully understand that people are using an agressive tone towards Microsoft! They haven't bothered to reply to the clearly legitimate and numerous requests for nearly 2 years. Microsoft aren't polite or showing good manners, they are extremely ignorant showing the community they don't give a ****. In my opinion, they regrattably lack the competence, there are so many bugs and awkward solutions in Excel since years back, with the usual explanation "it's by design". Such replies are only telling me "we don't know how to fix it"

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Exactly David, the possibilities to connect different requests including advanced formulas when using Excel makes the usage of Access impossible. I've built my company's whole administrative system in Excel, including business calculations, registration of purchases, orders and invoices, statistics, warehouse ledgers etc., the whole shebang. As there are many different databases I've tried Access but I lost too many interactions between calculations and the databases. Why use two applicationss when you can do the same in one! I barely survive with Excel 365 with all the difficulties but it's most annoying, certainly travelling with a laptop is a **** job.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    David Portwood, in my opinion Microsoft made the strategic move to SDI for several reasons.
    1. Memory allocation problems when opening several workbooks within the same container like in Excel 2010. How fantastic the program still is working in many aspects, it has bugs and crashes are common, especially if you have built some VBA procedures controlling the interaction between wb’s, opening, copy/pasting, closing, flushing variables, etc, etc.
    2. Creating an Excel for working with “simple” spreadsheets in tablet environments for the web was a priority where there accordingly was no room for VBA. Then they could stop the further development of VBA, which had become quite a big competitor to VB/Visual Studio. The VB Editor needs a bigger overhaul if it shall continue to exist as a programming environment for Excel, especially the Forms Editor and ActiveX components are relics from ancient times! Well, if that happened, who will buy Visual Studio?
    3. Even with OneDrive you could only exchange the web-version of an Excel file with your teammates. I don’t know if exchanging true original Excel Files works today in OneDrive, after a poor OneDrive test experience my company moved immediately to DropBox.
    4. If anyone in the future wants to run database application, move to Access for heck’s sake!
    Access, a dying application with a limited number of hard-core users needed more of the market share, otherwise it was threatened to be phased out!
    5. How many will buy an Office package containing a full spectrum of applications if you can manage all everyday tasks with Excel, Outlook and maybe Word? They must simply attract other segments and new users in the app-market, there’s a limited space for how much new features you can push into the 3 main app’s without they would become incalculable and heavy-handed.

    Hopefully Microsoft will kick some butts, employ new managers and come to their senses!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    I’m the owner of a small raw material trading company with 4 users working daily with several files linked to each other. We have several administrative forms written in VBA, currency database tables, computing statistics and business calculations with linked databases.
    The daily work is very often interrupted due to the poor interaction between Excel documents, copying and pasting of information, forced manual window sizing, VBA crashes, etc. and users are crying to me for making huge investments into tailor-made administrative programs.
    I’m traveling very often around the world with my 13-inch notebook where working with any calculation and database in Excel is incredibly laborious due to the limited screen space where the multiple ribbons are destroying the visibility.
    I’m reasonably skilled programming in VBA but it becomes ridiculous when you have to program every simple Excel workbook to be opened in the window size you saved it and position it on the screen to get a suitable working space!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Trefor, as far as I've understood this registry change refers only to the Excel.exe application itself, it has nothing to do with whether you want to open multiple workbook in the same window or not. You will anyway open each workbook in its own window with a separate ribbon and all other shortcomings, bugs etc. that have been described by Adam and others.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Well, maybe they will as I received a Message Center Major Change Update Notification regarding a new Office365 support declaration this morning with the following statement:
    "Microsoft 365 support is designed to be effective, efficient, and transparent to ensure a high-quality experience. We hope the new support features coming soon to the Microsoft 365 admin center will help reduce time to resolution and improve the overall transparency and effectiveness of the support process."
    There's a lot of bla, bla, bla about how efficient they gonna respond to all sorts of support tickets. Maybe something will trickle down to the UserVoice garbage can!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Stephen, I may add to the the problems with Personal Macro Workbook that if you use VBA to open and close additional workbooks, Excel is randomly unhiding the Personal Macro Workbook as and empty, grey workbook when at closing the later workbook. This workbook can not be closed unless you exit Excel entirely or hide the "shadow" workbook again! Furthermore, if you're working with other hidden workbooks, like we have, a currency table with links to the workbooks you're working with, you may end up with several visible "shadow" workbooks. I haven't been able to find out the conditions when this happens, it's random. Hence as many of us have concluded, Excel with SDI has terribly poor functionality and is definitely NOT any longer an application for multiple workbooks and an advanced spreadsheet environment and use of VBA. Like Anonymous stated, Excel is nowadays designed for tablets where you have very limited screen space and working with only one visible window at a time! This is a huge step backwards in the Excel development.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    If I may add no. 9 to Alan Odom’s excellent summary:
    Bring back the feature that workbooks are opened with the window size and position they were saved in!
    In Excel 2016/365 the second and following workbooks are opened with the same window size as the first opened workbook and cascaded down-right from it. This contributes to the loss of productivity as you always have to move every workbook and size it to fit the current workspace of the workbook.
    I can’t understand how a developer at Microsoft with even the slightest knowledge of working with Excel could come up with the idea and got sanctioned to remove size and position from subsequent workbooks. It’s such a waste, even those Excel users with dual monitors that may have some benefit of the multiple ribbon environment suffers.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Merry Christmas to Santa Microsoft MSFT, we have only one wish for a Christmas gift!
    We want MDI back and we'll be your supporters forever!
    Thank you dear Sir, we're much obliged!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    In my opinion they didn’t know what they were doing, they didn’t have a slightest clue what advanced users do with Excel. There are so many awkward solutions that never would have passed the functionality test so I guess they were just dazzled by programmers with a programming education rap sheet long as my leg, young skilled guys but without any experience of users daily work with office programs.
    I’ve other poor experiences with Microsoft elevated technicians and their knowledge are usually very narrow, not the broad experience of different computer environments they should have.
    Just look how they spend valuable development costs on new ribbon icons, for the benefit of what?
    It’s nothing else but children playing!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Hi Doug, maybe you have some special conditions, but I tried to reproduce the problem opening 3 workbooks, sizing and moving them to a position and then maximizing and restoring back and forth. It worked for me to the last known position and window size so I don't know why it happened to you, I also got KB4471324 installed today! Unless there are many workbooks that may have different positions depending on the current situation, the only solution is to write a vba-procedure in This Workbook where you exclusively position and size every workbook when it's opened ( Sub Workbook_Open() ). With a bit of logistics you may also position workbooks depending on the previously opened ones.
    But as we've pointed many times before in this thread, Excel365/Excel2016 nowadays seems to be a developers Kindergarten. Everybody at Microsoft is overwhelmed about the bling-bling and fancy stuff, nobody cares about user functionality!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    If I may add to Alan Odom’s excellent summary the following:
    Excel doesn’t open following workbooks in the window size or position they were saved! If there is another workbook already open, the next workbook opens in the same window size and cascaded on top of the first one. It maybe looks neat and tidy but is stupid and totally unnecessary. Who’s running different workbooks in identical window sizes and stacked on each other?

    Adding to no. 2, Screen space. Try opening 3 workbooks on a 13-inch laptop! Your entire display is filled with ribbons! Sizing the workbooks windows to fit the display will squeeze the ribbon beyond recognition but it maintains its height, still taking up the vertical space.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Anonymous, Do you really believe that dumping MDI in favor of SDI (having both from the beginning) was an active wish from users? I'd say definitely not! I don't pity Microsoft for spending money on developments without having a clue on the consequences when removing important features at the same time. If you care to read the posts in this thread it becomes obvious that the removal of MDI had a serious, negative impact!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    David Portwood, you are absolutely right, it's a poor workaround! Unfortunately we have to live with the flickering display, especially as Application.ScreenUpdating lost its proper functionality with SDI. Adding a focus parameter to the WorkBooks.Open method would be a salvation! HEY MSFT, ARE YOU READING! But are you sure about the ceased VBA support? As I've understood it they stopped licensing VBA for NEW applications and reduced the VBA support for 64-bit Excel. I certainly hope your'e wrong about it!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    David Portwood, I've solved it by minimizing the window right after it's been opened. In that way he focus is returned to the main workbook.
    I've a one-line IF statement in the main workbook, This Workbook - Workbook_Open procedure:
    On Error Resume Next
    If Workbooks("TraderCalcs.xlsm") Is Nothing Then Workbooks.Open Filename:="TraderCalcs.xlsm": ActiveWindow.WindowState = xlMinimized

    I hope it helps

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    If only Microsoft would give us a status on the development, is there any chance for a revival of MDI at least latest until Office 2019! As you can see by the comments, many are desperate about the deterioration on the Excel functionality and there are enough votes to really address the many issues SDI brought us. I believe you owe that to your loyal customers or are you just too prestigious to admit you made a huge mistake removing MDI. Even if the worst would happen, a return to MDI (incl. SDI) is not possible, please tell us and maybe we can start looking for solutions; develop our worksheets, rebuild our procedures, merging workbooks, etc. Silence has never been and will never be fruitful for a customer relation, so please give us a heads-up!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    It's so frustrating working with Excel nowadays but I'm stuck with Office 2016/365 as I've built our entire calculation and administrative system with plenty of procedures and forms. But the current Excel is a despicable anomaly, you can't even work independently in each ribbon. Try opening a sub-menu window like Name Manager, then you can't even switch windows to the other workbook! Removing MDI for the purpose to benefit those with multiple displays was utterly crazy and only shows how little Microsoft knows about what their customers are doing with the program.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    It's very frustrating that there's no more information from the Excel Team except this 2 months old message!
    HEY EXCEL TEAM! PLEASE REVERT WITH SOME FEEDBACK ON THE SDI/MDI ISSUE!
    YOU MUST HAVE NOTICED THAT PEOPLE ARE DESPERATE AND YOU'VE GOT ENOUGH VOTES TO SPEED UP THE PROCESS.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Hey guys, don't forget voting! It's needed to keep the pressure on the developers!
    As bksouthard says, Excel 2010 had the possibility to run both MDI and SDI, you could even set it in File/Options so why did they skip it? Probably memory allocation had to do with it.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Squander Two, using Alt-Tab or Ctrl-Tab for navigation is the least of the problems with SDI. If you care to read through some of the posts you'll find the SDI issues have created severe problems for many users, like workbook integration, automation, running procedures, cascading workbooks in same window sizes and ghost workbooks, etc, etc.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Bianca, if it concerns a worksheet within a workbook it should not be any problem! If you have the destination workbook and the attachment open, right click on the tab for the sheet you want to move or copy. Select "Move or Copy" and the destination workbook then "Before sheet"-location where you want it copied or moved.
    Click OK and Voilá!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Noelani,
    please explain how you're doing this! I cannot open two workbooks within the same window frame in Excel 365 or 2016.If I open the first workbook and drag&drop the next one from Explorer into the window of the first, it opens as a second separate cascaded window, with its own ribbon.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    David Portwood - sign in in the top right corner!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Please Microsoft, put effort in to this and do it fast! There are so many issues with SDI you can't ignore it any longer: copying and pasting problems; running procedures with multiple workbooks; workbook window sizes and cascading; hidden workbooks from new instances appears as blank workbooks after procedures have exit; userform execution problems with multiple workbooks; identical ribbons taking too much space; random switching between workbooks; if one workbook crash/stops working, all other instances are locked up/crash anyway......only to mention a few problems! Bring back MDI!!!!!!!!!!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    FSoriano: Post your problems on the different Excel forums like MrExcel or Stackoverflow. There are plenty of expert programmers available to help you out! Good luck!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Hey FSoriano and Col Delane: there shouldn't be any problem copying and pasting information between different workbooks if they are referenced properly and you don't need the PMW to do it.
    I use a Workbook_Open procedure in ThisWorkbook on the main WB to create my environment and opening the data WB's. In that way they always have the same premise when I copy information from the data WB to the main one. You may even set a reference to the main WB in VBE/References, then you get access to the objects in the main WB from the data WB. (Now the main WB cannot be closed before the data WB). I use the PMW only for generic tools, i.e. small procedures that should be available across any workbook I open. The PMW definitely has a problem when it's hidden as I commented earlier.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    Yeah,
    you wonder why Microsoft encourage us to comment on UserVoice when they never pay any attention! But every week I receive feeds about all new fancy features they created in Sharepoint, Office365 Online and Office365 admin center. What about putting some efforts for fixing up a dysfunctional Excel. No never, because it would be to admit they took some poor decisions! Sigh!

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    We are also considering reverting to Excel 2010, it was an excellent version!
    Another problem with the SDI is that if you work with hidden workbooks, (the most common is personal.xlsb but we have others as well) and run a procedure that opens another workbook, you'll get new instances of the hidden WB's as well. When the procedure eventually is closing the second or third workbook, Excel doesn't know how to handle the hidden ones and opens/keeps them as blank visible workbooks. You have to manipulate them via VBA or manually hide them again to get rid of multiple blank workbooks as they can't be closed, they are connected to the parent session! This is a fundamentally poor programming solution and I'm very disturbed that Microsoft never is coming up with a solution to a well-known problem.

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    I couldn't agree more, let us have the multi-workbook, single session back. At the same time please let us get back the feature that workbooks are opened in the window size and in the position they were SAVED and NOT in the same size as the parent window and overlapping each other. Where's the logic? Then one who came up with this stupid idea should be banned from all programming.

  3. 131 votes

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    When you say that it opens a different size – can you give more info? Do you mean the application window is a different size (it shouldn’t be) or that the font sizes (zoom) are different? (again, they shouldn’t be)

    Additionally, if you can post a video of what you’re seeing, that would be a big help for us.

    If there is a problem here, it’s definitely something we’d want to fix.

    Cheers,
    Dan [MS]

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    Mats Samuelsson commented  · 

    It's very annoying that no matter the saved window size of my workbook it opens in the same size as the first one opened in an Excel session. Now that we've since Office 2013 been "forced" to open separate windows (each with its own identical ribbon) for all workbooks it's strange that each window isn't treated separately. Where is the logic? Can it be solved?

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  4. 40 votes

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